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Discussion Starter #1
Ménage à trois: Nissan-Renault-Daimler

I thought it would be a good idea to aggregate and clear up details concerning the agreements between Daimler and Nissan-Renault. As we all know the Q30 will be making use of the MFA architecture that was co developed with Mercedes Benz. However, the collaboration and hugging don't stop there.



There is a minor financial tie in, which is simply a symbolic stake exchange of 3.1%. Renault gave Daimler 3.1% of their newly issued shares in 2010, Daimler then received 3.1% of Nissan shares that Renault owns. Then to complicate things even further Renault traded Nissan 1.55% of their new stake in Daimler for an additional 2% stake in Nissan, meaning Renault and Nissan each hold 1.55% of Daimler.



So what was the point you may be asking? Hold on we're getting there...

  • Renault-Nissan provide small displacement 3 and 4 cylinders to Mercedes Benz modified to their liking. The first application of engine sharing was the A-class which then trickled out to the CLA and GLA.

  • Daimler is now supplying Infiniti with petrol and diesel flat 4s and V6's. I'm not entirely sure if the small 4 cylinders are the same Renault 4 cylinders that had been modified for Mercedes.This is a clear indication that the Q30 will be using the CLA's powerplants in Europe and North America, the M270 petrol 4 cylinder and the flat 4 diesel from the CLA 180 for Europe and emerging markets.

  • As we know this partnership has expanded to include shared platform development. The first fruit was the MFA but now there are new rumors that the two will be collaborating on a midsize SUV platform. The thinking is that the next gen QX70 and Mercedes ML will share architecture. Expect to see this for 2017.
 

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Do you think that this new architecture will be used for any brand new models, or are we just going to see it used to underpin next-gen models? I think that there is more of a chance of Mercedes using it for a new model than Infiniti.

Wow Mr Ghosne and Dr. Zetsche must be good friends.

 

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there could be new models but what could they possibly use?
there's already a lot they have and probably a good amount they don't
 

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Its seems like more and more partnerships are popping up all the time. Its an interesting dynamic working with your competitors so often. It seems to be optimal for the companies and consumers too.

Remember that this platform can also be used for Nissasn vehicles, not just Infiniti vehicles.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Its seems like more and more partnerships are popping up all the time. Its an interesting dynamic working with your competitors so often. It seems to be optimal for the companies and consumers too.

Remember that this platform can also be used for Nissasn vehicles, not just Infiniti vehicles.
It could be, but nissan already has a well developed portfolio of CUV and small car architectures. The reason the MFA was developed with Benz was because the nissan small platforms we're not premium enough. Its unlikely Infiniti shares with Nissan in order to protect their models from dilution.
 

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i have seen some news on the future of nissan and it doesn't seem like there's anything they will have that's infiniti platform based, i could be wrong
 

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I'm sure Infiniti and Nissan have close ties

They use similar parts so if Nissan gets new stuff so does Infiniti (eventually)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I'm sure Infiniti and Nissan have close ties

They use similar parts so if Nissan gets new stuff so does Infiniti (eventually)
yea they share engines, but they dont share platforms. I like it better this way...
 

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That doesn't seem to be a very efficient way to run the company though.

Isn't Ford sharing vehicle architectures with Lincoln in order to save money? Obviously Lincoln isn't the best place to look for business advice, but I think it just is an example of how you can use the same platform to make totally different cars.
 

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I'm sure Infiniti and Nissan have close ties

They use similar parts so if Nissan gets new stuff so does Infiniti (eventually)
Infiniti is Nissan, so there's no doubt that will always happen. Same goes for Ford and Lincoln, Toyota and Lexus, the list goes on
 

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Discussion Starter #12
That doesn't seem to be a very efficient way to run the company though.

Isn't Ford sharing vehicle architectures with Lincoln in order to save money? Obviously Lincoln isn't the best place to look for business advice, but I think it just is an example of how you can use the same platform to make totally different cars.
no its not platform sharing thats important, its component sharing. Look at VW/Audi every vehicle shares modular components but none of them share a platform. Its a bit like Lego.

It allows you to protect the integrity of your products.
 

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good point on component sharing. platform is well, just the platform, components make up some of the most costly part of the cars so they might as well use it as many times as possible
 

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no its not platform sharing thats important, its component sharing. Look at VW/Audi every vehicle shares modular components but none of them share a platform. Its a bit like Lego.

It allows you to protect the integrity of your products.
But in the case of Infiniti and Mercedes that are indeed sharing the actual platform correct?
 

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^ for the most part yeah.
But Mona has a point.
The more things they can share the better. Components make up a lot of it, great way to save and make even more money.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
But in the case of Infiniti and Mercedes that are indeed sharing the actual platform correct?
the Daimler/Renault-Nissan tie up is a component sharing agreement. So yes the basic architecture was developed and shared, as are several engines flowing both ways. For instance the CLA/GLA use Renault sourced diesel 4 pots, The Q50 is using the CLA's M270 Turbo as base engine outside of North America.

The difference between the MFA and the Audi example I used above is that Audi/VW is able to take advantage of being a joint company, where this Daimler/Renault-Nissan deal still has to worry about maintaining individual competitive advantages.
 

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that makes sense. but since infiniti/nissan and mercedes play in a far enough realm of customers.

i dont think it would be too much of a concern as say if BMW and Mercedes were to start working together.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
that makes sense. but since infiniti/nissan and mercedes play in a far enough realm of customers.

i dont think it would be too much of a concern as say if BMW and Mercedes were to start working together.
Thats true too, but you have to think Mercedes must be a little weary of helping out a rival who is gunning for their back. It may not be a direct assault like say BMW could orchestrate but Mercedes is certainly helping to elevate Infiniti, or is Mercedes lowering themselves down to infiniti....
 

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other brands have done partnerships like this and they all have proven to be good, doesn't seem like they care about helping out a rival
 
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